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WiiLi.org
a new revolution
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AerialX
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 2
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 7:40 am Post subject: WiiLi OS Brainstorm |
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As has been brought up before, random ideas are thrown around in different threads and forums, so I've only caught very little bits about what you all (admins, devs, and users alike) expect WiiLi to function like. I understand that WiiLi Link is supposed to be a rough mock up to outline how it will really function, but no one's proposed one as of yet, and I think there should be more direction.
Note: This is meant to be a more development-oriented discussion on the core WiiLi distribution. For application requests and such try posting in that thread (apparently I can't post URLs, so find it yourself; it's in this forum).
Now, while the actual methods of the distribution of code on the Wii may be unsure at the moment, I'm just going to outline how I see a typical experience using a couple points from the Feature Request page as a guide.
First off, what should actually booting into it be like? If the ability to package your own channels for the Wii becomes available, this is something that may pop up:
| Quote: | | Boot directly into a particular component (have linux hidden as much as possible). Ex. Boot directly into an emulator without having to load into a linux GUI. |
If the actual boot time of the kernel and the time to run one specific application can be trimmed down to a reasonable time, being able to generate a channel to throw you right into your favourite application without further hassle would great. And once you're in Linux, there should be no reason why you can't reach a home menu when you want to access it (more on this later... well, now, actually).
However, the time taken to boot the kernel may be a while, and in that case users may prefer to boot into a home menu / bootloader interface (this also may be the only choice to boot into homebrew code too, via the Disc Channel, which will only leave this one option).
Personally, I'm seeing this as being very similar to the Wii menu interface itself, to keep the Wii spirit/feel going throughout. This interface will allow you to completely customize the experience with more power than the Wii, which only lets you rearrange your channels. The user would be able to create their own channels to run whatever they wish, and developers can package their own applications as a channel.
| Quote: | | An easy to use UI framework that supports alpha, animation, and video/audio streaming and provides a more unified look and feel. |
This is my favourite, and something I regard as very important. One global GUI toolkit should be created to ensure everything fits in, to further integrate all applications as part of WiiLi beyond just being random ports. This will provide standard widgets as well as the ability to easily create your own still with the same look.
The way I see this going? The launcher menu uses this toolkit to present a Wii menu-esque interface to allow the user to launch applications. It uses a simple window manager with a basic tabbed way of multitasking, but the Wii simply doesn't have a large enough resolution to make acceptable use of the standard PC window manager experience. For compatibility purposes I'd say to offer a lightweight WM like Xfce and allow GTK/Qt applications to run, but only use them if really needed because they will not fit in. Ideally WiiLi devs can provide any app you could ever desire on your Wii 
And then there should be a framework/library to manage all aspects of WiiLi. It handles all options related to operation and GUI LAF. Most importantly: it handles module management. Let's take another request from the wiki:
| Quote: | | A module page, like one similar ipod linux module page |
Ah, iPod Linux... Podzilla was a nice way to get around and its module page allowed you to easily install modules for it whenever you wanted to. But that was an iPod, a small device with limited capabilities. Let's go beyond a module page. The Wii has 802.11g wireless capabilities, abuse it  . Seriously, create a server-side database to allow users to browse through and select modules they want, and allow WiiLi to automatically download them. Have users able to upload to this database (warn about unsupported code, someone might try something :/) and implement an update system as well, so the Wii will automatically download updates for modules you use. These modules can take advantage of the main framework to integrate into the menu upon installation... And so much more, but you get the idea.
In a nutshell, what I would like to see is pure integration of various components to create an ideal experience. Standardize a GUI toolkit to be used in all applications to further unify everything (and mimic the Wii look?). Use that toolkit to create a menu interface to provide access to the various parts of the distro from one simple interface. Have one standard framework that manages all aspects of it from module management to providing apps a way to edit these standard settings and futher integrate themselves into the UI. Just make WiiLi stand out beyond being just a port of Linux to a non-PC (and I'm looking at you, DS Linux).
I've been lurking around for a bit here, and am quite interested on a Linux implementation on the Wii. I'm hoping the image of what this will actually look like can become more vivid/solid, and that we can brainstorm here. I've actually started on my own preliminary WiiTK (TK==Toolkit), and eventually that may lead to me creating a Link disc, but it's way too early right now to give it more than a mention
So, what do you guys see in WiiLi beyond it being "Wii Linux"? Of what I've mentioned, what would work, and what needs clarification/improvement? What might I have missed? What do the other devs here think, and what would you users like to see?
- Aaron
PS / Side note: Would a mod consider upping the posts-per-page count here? It's really annoying to have to switch pages every 6 or so posts. |
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Ich1980
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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wouldn't we be able to create a boot menu... which os you want to boot WiiLi or the original Wii System... okay it is maybe a bit too early because we have only some codes and these are for the disc channel but in the future...
and you have spoken about an modular interface... do you mean like Debian for Ubuntu Kubuntu and so on? that is a great idea because nobody would have problems to install apps on the wii shich they have donwloaded maybe with the wii... the wii is a system with a lot possibilites eventually not hardware sided but software sided... freeware games or something like that could be created... |
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AerialX
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 2
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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As for the boot menu, it is pretty early right now. From what I understand only code can be run through the disc channel, which is sufficient to allow us to boot WiiLi into its own main menu, but you have to go through the Wii. Only time will tell to reveal other methods, I leave that to the experienced hackers
Yes, something like the many Linux packaging systems, but ideally it'd be more user-friendly with an easy-to-use web interface. It'd be specially designed to integrate into the WiiLi distribution and its specific software so I don't think it'd actually use aptitude or whichever package manager the WiiLi distro uses internally. I'd be much easier to keep track of the modules with our own subsystem.
I don't yet have internet on my Wii, but I'd imagine it to be something along the lines of buying VC games, without paying of course
Core module management would greatly benefit WiiLi like this with a central repository because updates can be automatic and installing new games will be as simple as a few clicks of the Wiimote. It's pretty early but even if you're not able to install WiiLi and only able to use a live CD (hopefully a way to boot from external USB drives or SD cards if WiiLi is small enough will come around), a module system like this should let you be able to retain your installed apps.
Now that I think about it, let's take this feature request:
| Quote: | | # Ability to be fully customizable, like slax with myslax creator (so you can download and choose the modules that YOU want) |
And say that instead of creating your own ISO or something, you download a base WiiLi distro with only the core framework and minimal applications and then you can either a) Use the Wii's internet to then download modules and customize it as you like, or b) Download modules yourself from your PC (ideally with a semi-automated packager) and stick them on an SD card to customize your experience. Then the module manager will allow you to either just use the modules right from an SD card, move them to the Wii's internal storage, or to an external HDD. |
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